Barking Carnival — Blog — Remembering Nov. 18, 1999

Most cultures, modern and ancient, have ghost stories. Even cultures that do not have an afterlife in their religious cosmology are concerned about the restless spirit, kept from its deserved rest.

The great secret that the young do not know, but those older do, is that death in itself is not to be feared. Death is the natural end of things, and we all become better acquainted with it as we age. The great tragedy is leaving unfinished business when dying- the promises not kept, the important message unsaid, the blessing not given. That is why the deaths of the young are so hard to accept.

There are two major competing narratives of the events of late November, 1999. The first is that the Aggie Bonfire, one of their dearest traditions, had grown beyond sound engineering design and industrial safety principles, and had tragically collapsed, killing 12 student volunteers and injuring a couple dozen more. The next week, the Texas A&M football team defeated the Texas Longhorns in a football game, 20 – 16. This game gave comfort to the Texas A&M campus, but in no way lessened the magnitude of the prior week’s tragedy, and indeed these were two separate and unlinked events. During the game, there were formal recognitions of the loss, but this was more of a function of the game as the next major university collective event than the possibility of gaining any redemption from the game. Going forward, it is understood that the best way to honor the dead is to remember them, how and why they died, and to never again let the students undertake such a task without proper supervision and controls.

There is a second narrative, suppressed 10 years ago, but coming to the forefront now. This telling says that the bonfire had deep spiritual significance to all Aggies, and that its value was too high to surrender. The claim here is that the kids died doing something they loved, and that should be respected. Here, the Aggie win is seen as a victory for the spirit of bonfire, inspiring an underdog Aggie team to victory. Per this telling, the best way to honor the dead is to use their memory as an inspiration in the annual football game with Texas.

Think I’m exaggerating? That no right thinking person could think that a football game can “make up” for the deaths and maimings of dozens? Guess again. That view is gaining more and more hold among the Aggie faithful, supported by some Aggie officials who were not even on campus 10 years ago, and its advance is shameful.

The 10^th anniversary of the collapse was November 18, 2009. Texas A&M had timely and appropriate on-campus recognitions. The next Aggie home football game was against Baylor on November 21. That was not the campus gathering where the tragedy was recognized. The November 26 game against Texas was the game where the anniversary was commemorated. When questioned why this game, and not the Baylor game, Ags say it is because the bonfire was for Texas, and not for Baylor. It is as if the deaths made any imagined link between the bonfire and the game stronger, not weaker.

The TAMU athletics department is selling an inspirational DVD that explores the bonfire history, the tragic, lethal collapse,…and the 1999 football victory. They previewed this video for the students before Wednesday Yell Practice. The message? “It happened 10 years ago, and IT CAN HAPPEN AGAIN IF WE GET FIRED UP.”

Why should anybody care if the Texas A&M AD should do this? After all, they obviously need all the cash and inspiration they can get. Longhorns should care, because it is tasteless, classless, and the ideas it inspires are dangerous. Let’s be clear- in no way did the Aggie win in 1999 lessen the tragedy of the prior week. No sane person can imagine a parent of one of the fallen finally steeling themselves a week after the funeral, entering the child’s bedroom in order to sort the clothes and belongings to be donated to charity from those to be given to cousins, and thinking to themselves, “At least we won that football game.” For those who were actually close to the victims, winning the game gave absolutely no relief, just as losing would not have made the burden more difficult to bear.

Contrary to what many Ags post on Texags.com and elsewhere, that these students “died doing what they loved” is not a relief. Nelson Rockefeller also died doing what he loved. If he had known what the result was to be, he would have instead gone home early an had a cup of tea before getting to bed early.

Neither winning the game, nor bringing the bonfire tradition back, gives meaning to their death. The sad fact is that 99.99% of humanity will have no meaning in their deaths. That senselessness adds to the tragedy of their too soon deaths.

In the years since, an independent investigation revealed some uncomfortable truths (of course, in this world very few truths comfort, and those that do must be held tight) about the role of the Aggie culture and its emphasis on tradition and conformity in causing the collapse. The university shielded its financial responsibility behind state laws limiting liability. It built a monument to the 12 that died. It is a much more meaningful monument than many realize, with stone gates pointed in the direction of their home towns- a silent reminder that this campus is not where their too short lives were lived, but rather where they ended. It is a natural human emotion to want to find meaning in the deaths and sufferings of those close to us, to see God’s hand active for a higher purpose. Sometimes the actual meaning is that there is no meaning, the pain increased by the needlessness of the tragedy.

It is now 10 years later, and the Texas A&M athletics department is pimping the memories of these kids, in an attempt to increase the enthusiasm of the fans and the intensity of the team. It is classless of them. Texas A&M Athletics owns no claim on these kids, nor their families.

I know this is controversial. I thought quite a bit over whether seemliness calls for silence here. Realizing that Texas A&M is openly joining this issue to the University of Texas, by emphasizing their football game with us as the only appropriate venue for remembering the events, allows us to comment. Over the entrance to the tower in Austin, it reads “You shall know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” It’s fair to talk about what is true, and what is not.

Texas A&M approached UT about being a participant again in bonfire collapse recognition ceremonies, offering a chance to recapture good will earned 10 years prior. Wisely, Texas declined. Mack Brown recognized that any such moments would be far more about raising spirit to win a football game than about sincerely mourning a loss. Remember, the Texas sideline actually has several coaches that were there for those awful events 10 years ago. None of the Aggie coaches were (TAMU Recruiting Coordinator Tim Cassaday held the same position. He is on record as stating that “the Aggie Spirit” won the 1999 game). I was pleased to see that ESPN only gave a cursory mention to the Ags’ recognition activities.

I hope I get some dissenting comments. I really don’t want to think that the TAMU community is OK with the idea that their school is trying to use this event to help win a football game. Please, Longhorns, don’t reply with gripes about the Ramada Inn, or penalties. That’s not what this post is about. I have to admit that I am very relieved that Texas won. If the Ags had won this game, we would see this revisited every 10 years, and the myth of the “Fallen 12” helping the team beat Texas would overshadow the real lessons from that truly tragic events. The actual memorial site would become a prop for future football rallies, its actual purpose pushed to the side and forgotten.

Please, Bill Byrne. Let the ghosts lie, undisturbed in their deserved peace.

Article Tags:

Big 12, Bonfire, College Football, Texas A&M Aggies, Texas Longhorns

88 Responses

houstonearler said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 5:42 am

Great post.

The whole bonfire tragedy was so easily avoidable and so forseeable. That they now exploit it to get fired up against “t.u.” is reprehensible.
Mighty Texas said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 5:45 am

Aggys’ need incidents like the bonfire collapse to feed the cult monster that prowls there. Their efforts to suck us into it are deplorabe but not unexpected.
SydneyCarton said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 6:46 am

What a fantastic op-ed piece. Thanks for taking the time to write it and deciding to share it.
t1climb1 said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:04 am

Great piece. That college kids on a football team might rally around a tragedy such as this in a “let’s win one for the Gipper” sort of mentality is to be expected, and I think innocent. As 18-22 year-old kids, they lack the life experience, wisdom, and perspective that comes with age and I believe their rallying around this event is coming from a pure place however misplaced and misguided it may be.

That the administrators and coaches, grown men and women most of whom I presume have children of their own would do this is the part that I find to be bad judgment and in poor taste at the very least, and despicable seems the more appropriate word here.
jinx said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:05 am

We had a forensic engineer come and give the details of that collapse in one of my early engineering classes. The step-by-step outline of how the Aggies got to that point was eye opening. As houstonearler said, it was easily avoidable and forseeable. The Aggies take so much pride in their engineering program, yet let something like this happen.
Bob in Houston said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:09 am

I believe I heard that the school is unlikely to have any more public remembrances.

I posted here when Byrne was trying to sell the video that I thought it was unseemly for the athletic department to attempt to make money off of something that the administration has barred.

I would be surprised if there were no more events surrounding the anniversary. I happen to know the parents of one of the students who died, so my point of view is different than what it used to be.
FiesoleHorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:09 am

The bonfire report accused the students and administration of “tunnel vision”, and the collective aggie response:

“Tunnel vision? Whatever. I don’t even know what that means.
So, when do we get to do bonfire again

We have to do bonfire. Drunk freshman volunteers, rounded up from dorms in the middle of the night, climbing to the top of a poorly constructed 80-foot logpile to jerk off in a jar, is what being an aggie is all about.

We have to keep doing it.

We have to.

WE HAVE TO!!!!!”

Sick, sick people.
uncle teardrop said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:13 am

I am awed by this writing.
I’ve had the misfortune of burying way too many of my friends dying much too young. I could never imagine myself nor their families taking comfort from their premature demise in the outcome of a sporting contest.
RIP bonfire 12. May the memories that live on be of happier and more innocent times.
2xHorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:30 am

A gigantic RAMSHORN check for this essay Taylor. I found several aspects of the agroid’s treatment of the anniversary somewhat unseemly but could not articulate the reasons. I think you nailed it.

HOOKEM
Ed said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:32 am

Well said, from this Aggie who graduated in ‘98 and was at the ‘99 game.
Cricketslayer said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:41 am

Fantastic, write-up, Taylor. The fact that they just HAD to memorialize the bonfire collapse against Texas is fairly sickening. I don’t care that the bonfire was built for “t.u.” It’s not the bonfire that died, it was 12 kids. Most Ags look at it the other way around but pay lip service to the fallen to justify their beliefs.
nordberg said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:50 am

“Aggys’ need incidents like the bonfire collapse to feed the cult monster that prowls there.”
TaylorTRoom said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:59 am

Thanks for the comments, especially from Ed. I don’t think “most Aggies” look at the bonfire memorial as a reason to win a football game, but some believe there is some kind of linkage, on an emotional level, and are starting to be more vocal.

On Texags, recently, several of the players from TAMU’s ‘99 team were quoted in a Liucci post. Only one of them actually knew one of the kids who died, and interestingly, he was the only one who didn’t make a statement that somehow winning the game made things better. He talked of loss, of pulling together to get through tough times, but nothing of the game…and he was a starter, and played well in it.
Levander Williams said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:04 am

Trips:

This is a great piece – thanks for having the courage (and taking the risk) of putting it out there. UT’s inexorable role in this story provides us a unique position from which to observe and comment. I’m sure it makes a lot of people uncomfortable to hear these things from the Texas side, thinking that we’re piling on or being insensitive; it probably deeply angers a number of Aggies. But no one else understands this dynamic quite as well as UT and A&M fans, and so the responsibility for exhortation falls to us.

I tend to look at the Bonfire incident from a different perspective than many. I’m a degreed & licensed engineer, and I’m employed in a position that includes industrial safety responsibility for a large company. With that perspective, I’m still left speechless 10 years later at the profound lack of consideration for basic safety matters that became part of the culture of the Bonfire’s construction. Things that are Safety 101 for construction situations – things like fall protection, pre-job work planning, worker training, emergency response considerations, etc. – were no where to be found, and were steadfastly avoided for years leading up to this tragedy.

This is the type of recklessness that warrants multimillion dollar fines and bad press on a nationwide scale when it occurs in the workplace – and rightly so. This is the type of cultural indifference that gets people killed. Unfortunately, the Texas A&M culture has been allowed to pervert this incident into a rallying cry for a football game, calling it “good bull” and other such empty nonsense.

It’s disgusting, and the more exposure that can be brought to bear on this twisted perspective, the better.
Levander Williams said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:05 am

Taylor – sorry for the misattribution. I typed this in a hurry and neglected to check the byline.
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:22 am

I apologize for the length in advance (damn, if I had a nickel for every time I had to say that….

I’ll start by stating some of the comments above are way off target and veer pretty hard away from what TTR was trying to discuss. I shall not address any of those comments for fear of taking this thread even further off course – other than to state they are offensive and wrong.

I also have long been on the record that I support bringing Bonfire back to campus in some controlled sense. It has been an integral part of Aggie Tradition for decades and still should be. And if half the stuff in the report about the tragedy is correct, the details of how Push was done in 1999 were VERY different than the early 80’s when I was involved. I can assure you I never worked drunk – you were kicked off the site if you were drunk – neither freshmen nor sophomores were ever allowed on the Stack – credentials to do specific jobs were double checked at all times.

If done correctly, Bonfire can be brought back to campus. However, I doubt the lawyers will ever let it happen. And that is a loss.

Now, on to TTR’s commentary. Well written and thoughtful. I do think that your lack of familiarity with Bonfire has colored your opinions though. It is impossible to disengage Bonfire from the Game. The Bonfire ALWAYS existed because of the Game. If the Game had not first existed, Bonfire never would have developed.

Bonfire did not exist as a vehicle to build Aggie unity, celebrate our Maroon-ness or anything of the sort – it specifically was about “beating the hell outta t.u.” Bonfire is the one aspect of Aggie Life that I will agree with y’all that “it’s all about you”. Texas fans often brag that Aggie culture is built around a hatred of “t.u.” That is a horn-centric opinion and patently false EXCEPT in the case of Bonfire which was ALWAYS specifically about beating you.

So it is difficult, nay impossible, to have a remembrance of the event without dragging you into it. It would have made no sense to have a remembrance at the Baylor game.

I think the message the AD, and Yell Leaders, and all involved last week was trying to get across was: “Even though we no longer have a Bonfire on campus, we still have the Aggie spirit it takes to beat t.u.” And I will agree that they did it poorly.

The University continues to struggle with the competing factions within itself that say: (1) “Bonfire was a great thing that built Aggie Unity and helped cause alumni to really love us so they continued to donate and send their own kids here and do all the stuff we really want alumni to do” vs. (2) “the liability is just too high and we ought to move on.” Hell, Gov. Goodhair has stoked the flames of discontent himself with his idiotic proclamations. Maybe next year, y’all can get your own cheerleader as Governor so she can embarrass your University on a regular basis.

All that being said, I will agree that Bill Byrne was at best ham-handed, at worse moronic, in how he and the University Administration pulled off the remembrance. It reminded me of my favorite Zig Ziglar quote: “The only sure fire way to please nobody is to try to please everybody”.

It came across as if we were supposed to have some kind of Virtual Bonfire of the Mind that would allow us to have the same kind of Aggie Spirit we would have from a real Bonfire and then go out and beat the hell outta t.u. This just pissed off the people that want Bonfire back on campus because it fell short. It also pissed off those people who want to move on because it was bringing back up the memory of Bonfire and making noises like someone officially in University leadership wanted Bonfire back.

The best way to pull off the remembrance would have been – hell, just remember them. Celebrate once again who they were and remember that they died way too young. But that would have been too simple and thus never would have happened.

I do think that this event will be the last official act Texas A&M University has with Bonfire. And that’s sad, because it doesn’t need to be that way.
Bateshorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:24 am

Fantastic piece, Taylor. First class writing.

The collective drift into total groupthink at Texas A&M continues to trouble me with each passing year. The inferiority complex shown by the Aggies is not unique. Any person familiar with an Auburn, Virginia Tech, Michigan St., etc. graduate has encountered this type of feelings, and given the way flagship universities tend to market themselves, as well as local state government favoritism, it is very understandable. As an academic institution, Texas A&M is a good school, particularily in the way it treats its undergrads, and it’s agriculture and engineering programs (Bonfire calamity not withstanding) should make every Texan proud.

In the past, the espirit de corps exhibited by the student body was a source of both amusement to onlookers and strength to Aggies everywhere. Unfortunately, this bond has grown to resemble a cult as time has passed, and I attribute some of that to the resentment in the way the University of Texas has grown to become a true Jewel in the Crown for the entire State of Texas from the confusing times of Akers/McWilliams and the S&L/oil crisis of the mid to late eighties. Collectively, Aggies brook little to no dissent externally or internally, and the true Aggie hardcore has grown from a 2 percenter type mentality to encompass the entire student and alumni population. Granted, given the naturally conservative and relatively undiverse political nature of the constituency, it’s not surprising, as socio-political allegiance on both sides has grown more partisan over the last decade and a half.

Having said all that, the Administration until recently took it’s job seriously as stewards of the school and seemed to rise above all the “old army/Good Bull” stuff that indicated allegiance and fealty to Aggie-dom( for lack of a better word). They were heads of a major land grant institution, not a bunch of kool-aid swilling ags. That clearly is no longer the case. And as the Corps mentality has spread through the greater student/alumni body, A&M increasingly looks like the Citadel, except there is no Pat Conroy to tear down the sacred idols of self worship. Criticism is so untolerated that to even speak poorly or question the Maroon gods is to invite exclusion for life from the kingdom.
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:25 am

oh – I speak of the comments by other posters, not by TTR.
uthookem said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:26 am

Taylor, I commend you on a very well thought-out piece, and the courage to place it here. I hope that it somehow garners a wider audience than the illuminati represented here at BC.

I was a sophomore at Texas when the tragedy occurred, and had friends at A&M that had been working on the bonfire and thankfully were not there during the collapse. I also went to the game that year, and it was a truly serene experience. Sadly, as you stated above, the Aggie athletic department is still pimping the memory in an effort to stir up aggie pride to beat someone in a football game, and many aggies are eating it up.

It is telling, however, that no one has taken the opposite side of this argument yet. Maybe this is the illuminati after all.

Hook ‘em!
TaylorTRoom said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:27 am

Thanks, A-I-T. You get what I’m trying to say, I think- Remembering the 12 kids and mourning their loss is one thing. Remembering the lost bonfire tradition and mourning its loss is something else entirely. I think it is very, very wrong to entangle the two.
realmccoy said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:29 am

Very thoughtful and poignant post. The one thing that I cannot believe is that the University was not found criminally negligent in this tragedy. First, all Aggie jokes aside, this is a University with a tradition of excellence in civil engineering. Secondly, there is no reason that the structure had to be that size, and that unsafe to have a successful bonfire. Aggies conveniently forget this fact. The idea that this was a very unfortunate byproduct of a tradition is absurd. This was very avoidable with the just the least expected application of common sense.
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:31 am

I do get what you’re trying to saying – I was just pointing out that trying to totally seperate the Game from Bonfire is any impossible – they are intertwined.

By the way – did I see you at the Arlington City Councill meeting last night?
Savage said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:34 am

Amazing.
Savage said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:43 am

I was at the game last week. Throughout they ran videos to try to sell their DVD but they never listed as much as the names of the victims. Pretty telling and obvious to me.
Blueshorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:43 am

TTR,

Thanks for illuminating that pimp cult that is aTm. Excellent piece.
Levander Williams said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:43 am

“I do think that this event will be the last official act Texas A&M University has with Bonfire. And that’s sad, because it doesn’t need to be that way.”

Ag – I agree with you here 100%. School allegiance aside, Bonfire is one of the unique examples of college sports that makes it great.

I believe that an on-campus Bonfire can and should come back, but it must be done safely. Maybe it’s just easier to move it off campus and avoid the Administration altogether, but I don’t see why that it can’t return, assuming that the parties are willing to make changes. That is, unless there is just some institutional resistance (beyond the lawyers & liability concerns) that isn’t readily apparent to outsiders.
coloradoag said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:49 am

Well-written, thought-provoking piece. I appreciate that you outline your argument without the standard potshots aimed at Aggies. I was pretty young when the collapse occurred and am not a native Texan, so my perspective is certainly different from any red ass corps member. I would hope that the 1999 game and the subsequent games serve as a brief moment of respite and reflection for the large number of Aggies who cherish the lost individuals – not the lost tradition of a fire. Sports can serve as a brief distraction from tragedy as it did in the 2001 World Series between the Yankees and Diamondbacks in the wake of 9/11. The outcome of a mere game certainly does not lessen the impact of tragedy for the victims’ families and I would hope it does not lessen the impact for any rational human with a proper perspective on what matters in life. Aggies comprise a very unified populace that often falls victim to group-think in which dissenters are instantly deemed “bad Ags”. Well, I think the current athletic department leveraging a tragedy for marketing initiatives and financial gain is tacky at best and somewhat disheartening.

Thanks again for the post. Gig ‘em.
Sean said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:53 am

I’m an Aggie and I think that’s a great post and you make some great points. I’m a current student at A&M so I have never experienced the whole bonfire culture and it really makes me look it at the events in a different way. I always felt that there needed to be more accountability and responsibility for the deaths instead of just people saying how sad it is and we will always remember. I didn’t go to the game against Baylor, but that was a great point and I didn’t realize that. Another reason why they didn’t commemorate the collapse against Baylor because we weren’t on TV and they wanted to bring some national attention to tragedy with the game being televised.

As far as the actual collapse itself you do have to remember that the whole point of bonfire was that it was completely student run. No “adult supervision.” The fact that there weren’t more collapses is more surprising to me.
Another_Ag_View said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:55 am

The article author is off base…. Obviously written by someone who 1. Has no clue what they are talking about and/or 2. Most likely wast in JrHs/HS when it fell.

I ignored all the comments except the Ag_in_TX.
He is fairly accurate in the “trying to please everyone, pleasing no one” comment.

This paragraph was completely wrong and shows me he didn’t build bonfire as serious participant:
“Bonfire did not exist as a vehicle to build Aggie unity, celebrate our Maroon-ness or anything of the sort – it specifically was about “beating the hell outta t.u.” Bonfire is the one aspect of Aggie Life that I will agree with y’all that “it’s all about you”. Texas fans often brag that Aggie culture is built around a hatred of “t.u.” That is a horn-centric opinion and patently false EXCEPT in the case of Bonfire which was ALWAYS specifically about beating you.”

The running joke among worker was “we only burn it so that we can build next year”. Bonfire has a much deeper meaning beyond beating tu.

For 100k Ags, bonfire was 1 night a year that they got to have yell practice around a huge fire.

For the other 5k, it was 3 month’s worth of bad grades, hard word, new friends, building trust and showing teamwork. Sound familiar?
$B wasn’t pimping for the athletic department or trying any other bullshit. He was simply trying to help people remember something that he doesn’t understand himself.
BEHorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:59 am

I have two observations:

1. Re Ag_in_TX: “I do get what you’re trying to saying – I was just pointing out that trying to totally seperate the Game from Bonfire is any impossible – they are intertwined.” The two may have been intertwined historically, but it is entirely possible to honor 12 dead students on the anniversary of the event without mentioning a football game. JUST DO IT THAT WAY. Remember the kids, remember the spirit they were trying to embody, ponder the message of lives unlived … if you want to do it, you can. In fact, it is especially possible NOT to schedule the commemoration some number of days AFTER the anniversary, with the intent of expressly tying it to a football game. That’s not just “intertwining”, it’s pure profiteering — but, I suppose, much easier than offering “half-price tickets!”

2. I try to view the bonfire events through a prism of A&M (I won’t say “aggy” here) history. As we know, the school has a deeply-rooted tradition of sending its students into the service of our country. That core tradition always struck me as the foundation for all the others — not relationally so much as motivationally. In other words, a strong military tradition doesn’t lead to the bonfire, but the power of that tradition does generate a desire for “traditions” conceptually, which in turn leads to the development of other “traditions” as the core traditional precept (military service) wanes. So, as the student body grows and fewer partake of the true “spirit of Aggieland” (military service), other traditions have grown up to replace the core value. The bonfire was one such event, and a principal one at that.

With that as context, let us look at 1998: 12 kids die prematurely — just as they might have in combat. The Aggies response is consistent; referring to the kids as “The 12 Fallen”, etc. But here’s the rub: Just because they died too young doesn’t mean they died in combat. They died as the result of an exaggerated, foolish exercise in “school spirit” that had nothing whatever to do with service of the country … it just related to a football game. (That much, Ag_in_TX and I agree upon.) But given the core traditional precepts of A&M, and their tendency to conflate the values of ALL their traditions with that core value, Aggies by and large have a hard time stepping back and taking a hard, dispassionate look at these events. It isn’t fun to admit that kids were killed by something relatively needless and foolishly undertaken. Much better to construe them as fallen soldiers, in the true Spirit of Aggieland.

And, as a result, all commemorations are beyond reproach. Including selling DVDs to make a few bucks.
BEHorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 9:06 am

One more thought (sorry) — for Ag_in_TX, who believes that the bonfire commemoration and the UT football game are so intertwined that you can’t mention one without the other:

Re-read the Gettysburg address and see how many times Lincoln mentions “North” and “South”, “Union” vs “Confederacy”, or “us” vs “them”. The answer: ZERO. Not once. North and South alike are “these honored dead” … he refers to the conflict, but only in the most general terms. Because those lives, lost too soon, meant something far more profound than, “Hey, we beat the hell outta Lee’s army!”

I think we can agree that the Civil War was at least an “intertwined” with Gettysburg as the bonfire is with the UT-A&M football game … and yet Lincoln left a lasting blueprint for how to rise above such obvious — and yet, on the deepest level, immaterial — relationships and address the more profound meaning of lives lost too soon. I hope 10 years from now, the Aggies have achieved a similar level of introspection.
NY Horn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 9:30 am

A very interesting piece on a topic that should be discussed. Problems aren’t solved by shunning any and all examination of an issue as being disrespectful to those who fell victim to the tragedy. This situation almost reminds me of the cases of religions which don’t allow the use of western medicine to combat disease. A group of people were facing and accepted a foreseeable and substantial risk as part of their system of beliefs.
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 9:39 am

Another_Ag_View,

I’m not sure what your point was due to your disjointed grammar, but I can assure you that I worked long and hard on Bonfire every year I was a student there. I do thank you for your attempt to share your opinion, though.
Holy Cow said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 9:48 am

TTR, great and thoughtful post. It encapsulates my feeleings on the situation. Another_Ag_View you are precisely the type of aggie I despise and why I dislike A&M in general. You exemplify the types I grew up with in my youth and all the bs and nonsense I had to put up with in high school. I am a very conservative religious person, so it has nothing to do with “being a liberal t-sip”, but everything to do with an inability to see beyond an allegiance to a school on deeper more important aspects of life.
johnnymac said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 9:53 am

Making those kids into martyrs to a freaking football game was – and still is – despicable. It was appropriate to remember their deaths, but it should have been done as a memory of them and not as part of a pep rally. I saw those helmet logos last Thursday and my first thought was, “Wasn’t the anniversary last week? Why haven’t they been wearing those things all year?”

If you want to argue that somehow the two events are “intertwined” and therefore cannot be separated, then you are making precisely the point that Taylor was arguing against and it’s sick.
Another_Ag_View said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 9:56 am

Sorry my typing was not up to par. My post was originally an email to a friend that sent me your post, and I decided to share my reply to him. You can claim what you want on your buddy’s blog, but you really have no idea what you are talking about. I am sure you worked on it. You Probably went to cut once, and left at lunch. Maybe did half a shift at stack and then roasted marshmallows. Who knows.

I knew most of this kids. I went to their funerals. Don’t come on here and pretend to speak for them, their families, or their friends.
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:12 am

Well OK.

I can assure you I worked long and hard on Bonfire for the full four years I was there. I worked many midnight to 4 A.M. shifts. I faced south and sang “the song” at midnight if you need proof that I was there. I liked midnight to 4 A.M. as it didn’t interfere with class – just sleep.

Regardless, I think the opinions I voiced are those that many well reasoned Aggies have regarding Bonfire. I always thought those who sacrificed their grades and college careers to Bonfire were a bit off target with the concept of Spirit and Tradition. It is possible to do these things without destroying the prime focus of being in college.

And please don’t start the 2%er bullshit. I stood the whole game in the freezing rain watching Baylor thrash us in 1980 hoping my date would give me a kiss for a first down. We had losing seasons almost every year I was there and I still stood for all 4 quarters of every home game – I neve missed a single one. I have annually contributed to the University every year since I graduated in 1984.

That being said, from your comments, you obviously were a Redpot or Brownpot and I thank you for your service and dedication. I especially thank you for whatever comfort you were able to give to the families of those who died in this tragedy.
uthookem said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:19 am

Ag_in_Tx, FTW. Thanks for posting around here.
Blueshorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:19 am

“I believe that an on-campus Bonfire can and should come back, but it must be done safely. Maybe it’s just easier to move it off campus and avoid the Administration altogether, but I don’t see why that it can’t return, assuming that the parties are willing to make changes. ”

Any suggestion of a professionally supervised bonfire is rebuffed by the cult traditionalists. For the bonfire to be properly “spiritual,” it has to be like it was before, complete with the fish hazing, the outhouse, and the jizz jar.

This is one time when we can all be thankful for lawyers. Someone needs to protect aggy from being aggy and the rest of society from having to witness the horror that is aggy.
uthookem said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:20 am

WTF is the jizz jar?
Another_Ag_View said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:23 am

Not a pot but worked my ass off and I never said you were 2%. Obviously, Bonfire changed alot from 80 to 99 and most people that went to texas will never understand it.
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:24 am

A myth, for starters.
OldTimeHorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:24 am

The year before I arrived at UT, Charles Whitman had snipered from the Tower. It stayed closed for years. But it reopened. In a short interval, two students jumped to their deaths, and it was closed again but reopened in another year or so. Each reopening featured appropriate measures to safeguard against further tragedy.

How is that any different from the bonfire tradition at A&M? Let them have their bonfire. Who doubts that appropriate safeguards will be in place? And a more than respectful time has passed. This season I have twice seen a player lying on the field with open speculation that he might be paralyzed. Yet, we play the games and would continue to do so even if a young athlete ended up confined to a wheelchair for life, or worse. What’s the dif?

As for tying the bonfire tragedy to a subsequent victory over us and perhaps future ones, so what? Sports prompts lots of superstition and bravado. I read it here all the time. There was a piece here a couple of weeks ago full of what Mack Brown calls “poison cheese” about what a walkover the Aggies would be. Reading that hubris hurtled me back in time to sitting thru the ‘67 game at Kyle Field when a similarly cocky Texas contingent departed with sour stomachs and even more sour memories (to this day). Let ‘em have their traditions and their hopes of victory. Just make sure we always come out on top. It’s dreadful losing to Aggies.
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:24 am

I was talking about the jizz jar comment.
Blueshorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:27 am

That’s the jar the corps turds would whack off into, and then place it in the outhouse atop the log stack. It symbolized the UT Tower, of course.
johnnymac said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:28 am

The jizz jar is supposedly inside the little dollhouse they put on top of the bonfire, filled beforehand by some special group of corps members as some sort of mystical martial sacrament to the Aggie war god.

Only repeating what I’ve heard.
nordberg said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:30 am

“most people that went to texas will never understand it.”

Guess that’s just something I’ll have to live with. Oh well.
bateshorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:36 am

Well, if the debate between the Aggies on this thread doesn’t illustrate the issues with dissenting views and Texas A&M, I don’t know what does.

I attended Bates College in Maine. The first coeducational institution in New England, founded by ardent Abolitionists and possessing a history both older and just as respectable as Texas A&M. A universally recognized Top 25 liberal arts institution and a brutally difficult academic environment, I am justly proud of my degree and association with my Alma Mater.

I can not, under any circumstances, imagine a situation where I would claim I am more “Bates” than another graduate. Therein lies a very difficult problem for Texas A&M.
Walk Your Own Elephant said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:37 am

“A myth, for starters.”

I hope so. Mason jars should be treated with more respect..
Roach said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:48 am

This was an excellent piece. Certainly a risky, controversial subject due to the loss of twelve lives.

Selling DVD’s to commemorate this tragedy was and is a bad idea–fairly or unfairly it gives the appearance of profiteering off of 12 kids lives. The only possible justification I can see is if any profits were donated to a charity in the name of the students. I hope this is the case.

Linking the loss of those lives to the UT A&M football game is similarly tactless regardless of the historical link between bonfire and the football game. The death of those kids had absolutely nothing to do with the University of Texas, and nothing to do with the game. It demeans the memory of the kids to use their memory to win a football game. Twelve lives were lost, that it required such a tragedy to realize the folly of unsupervised students building an 80 ft high structure (the height of an eight story building) out of logs is beyond disturbing. Building codes would never allow an 80 foot high structure to be built out of wood with or without professional supervision. As an architect I cannot even imagine placing my stamp on something so foolhardy. The fact that a school known for the quality of its engineering program did not recognize the inherent danger prior to the loss of life is disturbing. The fact that a portion of the A&M student/alumni base would like to revive this tradition is simply not comprehensible.

I understand the sense of unity and accomplishment that can come from working together to accomplish a goal. But does the goal have to be a pile of firewood? Shouldn’t A&M redirect this school spirit to a project with even a small amount of benefit for the University or society as a whole? Wouldn’t it be better if the students replaced bonfire with some sort of service project?

Remember the kids forget the damn bonfire.
Roach said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 11:03 am

TO be clear on the subject of a “supervised” bonfire. I can’t imagine any licensed professional–architect or engineer–who would be willing to risk his or her license, reputation, career, and more importantly the lives of students to design and supervise the building of an 80 foot high log stack who’s sole purpose is to be burnt as a motivational tool for a football game. I would seriously question the judgment and ethics of any professional willing to do such a thing.
Scott said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 11:17 am

“Wouldn’t it be better if the students replaced bonfire with some sort of service project?”

That certainly would be “good bull.” But then you couldn’t burn/tear it down after it was done.

I’ve long thought the Aggies should do something like this (and maybe they do, but it certainly is on a smaller scale) and then just have a huge outdoor pep rally honoring the service they performed and then doing whatever goofy yells they need to do to attempt to beat us. I know they have yell practice before every game, but I imagine the money that was wasted on building the bonfire each year could be used to serve a greater purpose with enough left over to have the same campus wide party they had when the bonfire was around.
Sean said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 11:33 am

Scott said:

“Wouldn’t it be better if the students replaced bonfire with some sort of service project?”

We do have something like that Scott. Its called Big Event.

Check it out it: http://bigevent.tamu.edu/
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 11:45 am

My roommate in college was the guy who started up the Big Event. We told him, at the time, it was the dumbest fucking idea we’d ever heard of.
South06 said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 11:59 am

RE: The article – Great work. I agree that, while the students died “doing something they enjoy,” they did not die FOR BONFIRE. Twelve lives are way more important than bonfire ever was or ever will be. This is not a disputed point among any Aggie anywhere.

RE: Some of the comments – The level of hatred here astonishes me sometimes. But, whatever, we play you guys in sports and stuff so you should vehemently despise everyone who attended Texas A&M. That makes total sense.

RE: This comment – “Unfortunately, this bond has grown to resemble a cult as time has passed”

Negative. You get your opinions of A&M solely based on (1) what Texas fans are supposed to think, and (2) what Aggie internet message board posters say. Venture onto campus and you will see that you couldn’t be more off base.
bateshorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 12:07 pm

And the fact that I have family and good friends that went to A&M. But, whatever….
Blueshorn said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 12:13 pm

“A myth, for starters.” (re: the jizz jar)

I’ve seen ags claim the nut squeeze is a myth, too. Unfortunately, we’ve all witnessed it on national television.
Donny Boudreaux said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 12:45 pm

I was on the UT campus as a senior that year. It was a time of mourning and solidarity as we turned our hex rally into a prayer rally. It was a sobering time. I got in touch with old HS friends who went to ATM and caught up with them. Making sure that they were alright.

Then when the football game started it went back to the same old crap as always. TU sucks. Ramadagate and Applewhite happened to get food poisoning? Its hard for me to divorce the two. UT shows unprecedented grace and mourns with their brothers @ ATM only to get crapped on days later. I could swallow losing the game. It did in a very small way help the A&M community-at-large heal…. but the classless way our players were treated will always stick in my craw.

We bowed down and humbly tried to lend a hand… it seemed they responded by cutting it off.
Art Vandelay said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 12:48 pm

Ag_in_TX,

The fact that you said Bonfire 17 times in your post says something, and the fact that you called it “Bonfire” and not “The Bonfire” is silly and borderline David Koreshian.

Paying homage to a campfire, especially after the tragedy that occurred ten years ago is just plain creepy. In terms of The Bonfire being a great tradition…. Do you also gather your family and friends, pull them in tight and fire bullets straight up in the air on New Year’s Eve?
TaylorTRoom said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 12:53 pm

And that’s not really the direction I was hoping the discussion would go…
Ag_in_TX said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 1:21 pm

wow
EddieTheAlbinoSquirrel said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 2:09 pm

BEHorn said:
“12 kids die prematurely — just as they might have in combat. The Aggies response is consistent; referring to the kids as “The 12 Fallen”, etc. But here’s the rub: Just because they died too young doesn’t mean they died in combat. They died as the result of an exaggerated, foolish exercise in “school spirit” that had nothing whatever to do with service of the country … It isn’t fun to admit that kids were killed by something relatively needless and foolishly undertaken. Much better to construe them as fallen soldiers, in the true Spirit of Aggieland.”

I’ve had this same thought many, many times. I don’t think it’s only Aggy that has turned these kids into tragic “victims.” They media has played along as well.

Like everyone, I think these needless deaths were so very sad. Today, these young people should be working on their careers, having babies and cheering as alums. Unfortunately, their lives were cut short.

But the near-deification of these students has been disgusting. It’s almost as though, by painting them as servants working for a cause, the university hoped to deflect criticism from itself.

Ever see the Darwin Awards on the web? They may be cold and heartless, but they make a point. It’s one thing to memorialize and commemorate the deaths of soldiers serving their country, of innocent victims of crime, and of innocent victims of disease or accidents. But it’s entirely another to create a DVD that glorifies preventable death – just as it would be in bad taste to honor the death of a drunk driver who killed himself and others on the road.

No, I’m not an Aggy. But that “you people just don’t understand” attitude is what caused this in the first place. Not everything is a Sacred Tradition. Nor should it be.
Huckleberry said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 2:16 pm

Twelve lives are way more important than bonfire ever was or ever will be. This is not a disputed point among any Aggie anywhere.

Unfortunately, that second sentence isn’t true. Certainly true for the vast majority of Aggies, but I’ve talked to a couple that will dispute that point. Remember, every large group has their idiots.

Great piece, TTR.
Confused and dazed said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 2:22 pm

Did the DVD include footage of Toombs’ throat slashing gesture after scoring the winning TD as the “mourners” in the stands went wild in response. If not, they missed a great opportunity to memorialize everything that is about being a “TrueAg”.
Hornsup said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 3:03 pm

Reminds me ~~of Senator Paul Wellstone’s funeral in 2002 that the Democrats turned into a political rally~~ that there are no politics on this site.
South06 said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 3:22 pm

As a current student, I hope to hell I never become as bitter and hateful as the alumni of BOTH schools are. This site makes me ashamed. TexAgs makes me ashamed.

Current students at both schools seem so much better adjusted than you middle aged alums. I hope, all things considered, this becomes what it always should have been: a sports rivalry that has nothing to do with anything else.

Here’s hoping.
LonghornLawyer said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 6:14 pm

As most Longhorns do, I look upon A&M with equal parts fascination and disgust. This topic is no different.

Talking to my Aggie friends and watching from afar the commemorations in College Station, I am convinced that the memorials had little to do with the deaths of 12 students. Not that that should be surprising–”memorials” are rarely about individual dead. Unless you have a loved one who died in action, you don’t remember individuals on Memorial Day or Veterans Day. You remember the spirit and cause for which the individual and collective sacrifice was made.

This is no different.

What was being commemorated and memorialized wasn’t the students who died on the bonfire, but the death of the bonfire itself.

And the death of the bonfire isn’t just–or even primarily–about the loss of a tradition; it’s about the fundamental transition that has taken place (and continues to take place) at Texas A&M.

The bonfire is metaphoric of everything that Texas A&M was historically about. Students took off hours and hours of class to build the thing, sacrificing their grades and academic standing. But that was okay, because it built leadership qualities and taught teamwork. And that’s what Texas A&M was historically about (and by historically, I mean 50 years ago). As an agriculture school with a large military component, grades were secondary to the leadership training that Texas A&M afforded. That was a huge attraction to a lot of students, and was something that no other institution of higher learning really offered.

The mission of Texas A&M since then has slowly changed, first with the admission of women and the abolition of mandatory Corps participation, more recently with the foundation and emphasis on a business school and other non-agriculture, non-natural or applied science schools. Texas A&M is now a Tier I university–an honest-to-god good school with top professors, a highly achieving student body, and a rigorous curriculum.

That’s a big change from when the bonfire started.

The dirty secret is that by 1999, the administration and faculty had grown to hate the bonfire. It led to otherwise good students missing class and accepting unnecessarily bad grades. It created an atmosphere in which student leadership was valued over faculty lessons or administration judgment. And–let’s be honest–it was something that embarassed them at their academic conferences with their peers. Even if the administration wanted the bonfire to return, it couldn’t because of liability and insurance reasons. But the fact is, they don’t.

And that’s really what Aggies mourn. It’s not that they aren’t happy that their degrees are worth a lot more than they were 50 years ago. It’s that they–perhaps justifiably–romanticize the “Old Army” days when Bear took the boys to Junction, Corps membership was mandatory, and students could miss a month of class building a bonfire.

Since it does involve the deaths of 12 students, there is something unseemly about the entire exercise. But at the same time, there is something about the bonfire that is worth mourning–dammit, they’re just not as much fun as they used to be now that they’re a serious school.
AggieFormerStudent said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 6:24 pm

A texas graduate friend of mine sent me this link. An old Aggie saying goes, “From the outside, looking in, you can’t understand it. From the inside out, you can’t explain it.” As stereotypical as that may sound, it does explain the sentiments of much of the Aggie family towards our traditions. Bonfire was one of those (perhaps the most beloved) traditions. Aggies mourn the loss of that tradition.
Aggies also mourn the loss of our brethren, perhaps more so than any other institution I’ve been acquainted with. The traditions of Silver Taps and Muster are designed to publicly mourn and show respect to the families of our fallen fellow Aggies. When these traditions are first taught to incoming freshmen, the names of the 12 Aggies lost in the bonfire collapse are now read. As such, these students are memorialized over all of our previous fallen students because they died contributing to a beloved Texas A&M tradition, immersed in the Aggie culture.
I was not personally acquainted with any of the 12. I did, however, experience first hand how the entire institution unified in mourning the loss of those 12. That is a picture of the Aggie spirit to me. To say that Aggies have cheaply used their loss as a football game motivator sells us short. We mourn their loss, and celebrate the spirit of the tradition they died taking part in. In that sense, for those of us who never knew them personally, it allows Aggies today to make a personal connection with those 12, as a part of something bigger; Something they volunteered to take part in because they loved it, as we did. In celebrating bonfire, and a win against UT (albeit less important), it allows Aggies today to celebrate alongside those who were lost. If it had been me, it’s what i would want.
MansonKoreshJones said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 6:36 pm

“From the outside, looking in, you can’t understand it. From the inside out, you can’t explain it.”

As we were saying…
MansonKoreshJonesHubbard said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 6:37 pm

The jizz represents the souls of a thousand t.u. Thetans.
houstonearler said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:23 pm

“From the outside, looking in, you can’t understand it. From the inside out, you can’t explain it”

The rallying cry of any group of delusional dumbfucks who think they’re special. Newsflash, your dumbfuckery killed 12 kids for no good reason even though the criminal negligence of the bonfire was obvious from anyone with more than 3 brain cells.

My best friend in the world is an Aggie who was a big wig student leader of the bonfire the year before it collapsed. He was a certain color pot his first year. Another his second. And another color his third year. I think maybe a red or brown pot. Anyway, he was pretty high up. He supervised and went around raising funds for the build. You ask him and he will tell you that it’s a miracle that the damn thing did not kill someone years before. He told me about the drinking. About all the close calls and broken bones. He says there is no way it should come back.

Nonetheless, a bunch of dipshit agroids think reviving that clusterfuck is a good idea.
MansonKoreshJonesHubbard said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 7:47 pm

Houstonearler: you sound like you could be describing the Klan:

“My best friend in the world is an Klansman who was a big wig student leader of the bonfire the year before it collapsed. He was a certain color pot his first year. Another his second. And another color his third year. I think maybe a red or brown pot. Anyway, he was pretty high up.”

FTFY
Huckleberry said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 8:50 pm

From the outside, looking in, you can’t understand it. From the inside out, you can’t explain it.

Traditions are good. Nothing wrong with traditions. But I’ve never been able to understand why Aggies think the above quote is a good thing. It is basically a definition of abnormal behavior and could be applied to any deviant activity you wanted.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think Aggies are on the same level as insane deviants on the whole, but that saying they like to use doesn’t help matters.
Trips Right said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 9:49 pm

Awesome article. Nice work Taylor.
Bullneck said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:17 pm

Nice Nelson Rockefeller reference. Had to look it up.
java said:

December 2nd, 2009 at 10:21 pm

There are certain events in life that are preserved like a snapshot in one’s memory. I’ve read that for those old enough to remember, the Kennedy assassination is one of those memories, as well as, the explosion of the space shuttle on takeoff. For me, another of those memories is the collapse of that stack of wood and the loss of those 12 kids.

Anger didn’t enter the equation until my sister, an Aggie to the core, insisted that ‘Bonfire’ had to return. At the time, my daughter was a senior in high school and was strongly drawn to UT, but her boyfriend at A&M was trying to pull her in that direction. She had not committed either way.

When I heard the voices at Texas A&M clamoring that ‘Bonfire’ had to return, it suddenly seemed not only difficult to send Jacque to A&M, but irresponsible. I wonder how many other parents felt the same way after the collapse, not due to the collapse itself but due to the institutional negligence that made it inevitable.
James Tanner said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 6:03 am

Compliments to TTR, Ag_in_TX, etc. for handling this touchy topic with the proper balance of thoughtfulness and respect. Wish I could say the same of some of my other fellow commenters.

I had just graduated from UT in Spring of ‘99 and had a few younger friends from high school at the collapse that night, though thankfully only one was hurt and not too badly. It was one of those times when the jocular crudeness of school rivalry simply ceased to exist, at least for a little while. Because it’s all mostly for show. Aggies these days are mostly just a bunch of suburban kids from Houston. They aren’t really hick buffoons and they don’t really have sex with sheep. And you actually have to be pretty damn bright to get into aTm these days.

A few of those kids made an honest mistake and as a result a dozen innocent kids died. That’s awful, horrible, but no one should be discussing this with contempt as if anyone actually has blood on their hands. It was a mistake.

When senseless tragedy strikes, it then becomes incumbent on the people involved to make sure it doesn’t happen again. But my fellow Horns who point fingers at aTm tradition as if that’s responsible for the deaths are stooping too low. Given the many years Bonfire had been going on, there was no reason to expect it would collapse until it did. It was preventable in theory, the exact same way 9-11 and the Katrina floods were preventable. If only someone had perfect information before the fact…yadda yadda whatever. Again, it was a horrible mistake, and nothing more.

And also, personally I have no problem with Byrne, et al. holding a commemoration and linking it to the UT game. We were part of it, too, ten years ago, and it was nice for me personally to see the ribbons on the sides of the helmets and think back. It’d have been nicer if they didn’t try to monetize it as much, but c’mon, it’s not like they sold any more tickets because of it. And they’re not adding a new wing to the stadium off of those DVD sales. They’re just firing one or two less people in the sports marketing department. And I’m OK with that. Times are tough all around, and if a drippy commemoration DVD is what they need to do to keep their media people busy, so be it. The people who buy it won’t think they’re being ripped off or anything.
HenryJames said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 6:57 am

Given the many years Bonfire had been going on, there was no reason to expect it would collapse until it did.

No, it’s a miracle it didn’t collapse earlier.

It was preventable in theory

No, it was preventable if they had followed engineering guidelines like they used to.

If only someone had perfect information before the fact

We’re talking about building a bonfire. What you call ‘perfect information,’ everyone else calls preparation and professional oversight
Aggie Lurking said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 7:35 am

I’m of the opinion (majority I believe) that Bonfire although a unique and powerful tradition has run it’s course. It’s horrific to imagine the pain and suffering that the families and victims suffered because of this tradition. I worked on it as a student and I thank the Lord each Thanksgiving season that by His Grace that pile of trees (not sticks or lumber but 20 -30 foot trees) never fell on me. I despise Darrel Keith and anyone else who attempts to profit off this tragedy. I refuse to believe that the release of this DVD was an attempt to do that.

I believe the Texas Monthly story written this year best sums up the emotions of those who were there. I challenge anyone (even you hard hearted horns that refer to us as agroids,aggy or collie worshippers) to read that story with a dry eye. If you can I fear you have no soul.
James Tanner said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 8:03 am

Sure, that sounds right. Hindsight brings a lot of clarity, doesn’t it? But what you’re describing isn’t a moral failure. It’s a classic example of organizational failure.

There was no professional oversight because the students had done things correctly on their own for decades. It’s also students from a top-20 engineering school building a damn pile of logs. It’s perfectly doable – so doable that no one thought twice about how it was run. Thus there was no one with pro credentials watching to correct things when they went wrong. That’s a blatant mistake, in hindsight. But when that mistake starts occuring in the context of a bureaucratic organization like aTm or the Corps of Cadets, it will almost always linger until disaster strikes. It almost always takes disaster and hindsight to figure it out and that’s why it engineering disasters happen all the damn time. Ask the people at NASA, or the Corps of Engineers, or AIG, just to pick a few more egregious examples of flawed engineering from the last decade. By all accounts those men are individually brilliant; it’s organizational blindness that makes them look like utter buffoons.

And we all suffer from organizational blindness. If you disagree, I submit to you: John Mackovic.

Organizations everywhere tend to take a life of their own and make messes, and mistakes that seem obvious in hindsight often aren’t seen by the most knowledgeable people before the shit hits the fan. The organization gets in the way of that. That’s not an aggy thing, it’s a common feature of the human condition. Really good organizational leaders know how to prevent that from happening, usually, but they’re not exactly a dime a dozen.

You deal with organizational failure by coping, removing truly bad actors after-the-fact (and there’s none of those in the Bonfire collapse, unless you really think someone had prior knowledge), and correcting the problem going forward. Not by demonizing the poor suckers that got shepherded into a false sense of security and now have to live with the guilt of twelve teenage deaths for the rest of their lives.
James Tanner said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 8:09 am

Sorry, my above comment was directed to HJ not AggieLurking. And yeah Aggie, that is a touching story.
Trips Right said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 8:20 am

Ummm, how many aggie bonfires are built on an annual basis? F’n one.

How many roads, bridges, houses, buildings, etc. are built on an annual basis? How many fail?

If it was a case of organizational failure, there would be many more tragic construction examples, other than the bonfire, across the nation for you to point to. I mean, you do realize that there are hundreds of thousands of construction organizations (companies) across the nation that have flawless construction records. And they aren’t all run by Harvard MBA’s or Top 20 engineering school graduates.

And they are building things of worth, not just a pile of logs as you put it.

I’m astounded that someone would try to rationalize this. It’s frightening.
Diegosbone said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 9:20 am

For whatever its worth, I had a candid conversation with my son’s god parents, who were captains (or whatever) at ATM’s fish-camp back in their respective college years. I was surprised by their reaction to the whole bonfire build-up, has it debunked my conventional aggie wisdom thinking.
According to them, only the vocal minority (including ATM’s beloved Rick Perry) actually thinks bonfire should come back. The majority of the student population (again according to them) did not participate in the build. In fact many were annoyed at constant pestering across campus to participate in ‘cut’, ‘stack’ and ‘push’. The majority of the student population was embarrassed by the collapse and wish the whole thing would just go away. Again, these aren’t my words.
EddieTheAlbinoSquirrel said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 12:04 pm

To South06:

I’m glad that the younger generation is so much “better adjusted” than all of us old folks.

Perhaps the older generation here (by which I mean anyone over the age of 25) has a few things your superior generation does not. For example, my generation (mid-30s) grew up with a stronger understanding of right and wrong, rather than an instilled moral relativism. Also, us “old” people may have a bit more discernment and broader perspective, allowing us to better measure the lives of 12 young people against a “tradition.”

Finally, most of us are old enough to think independently, without the mushy, touchy-feely crap that is so much important than true intellectual rigor these days.
EyesOfTX said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 1:53 pm

I love that the replies to this thread turned into a classic circle jerk between cultists…er, Aggies about which one of them was a “real” red pot. Just so fitting.

They will be back building the wedding cake on campus with full university approval within the next decade. 12 dead students can’t stop that good ol’ Aggie TRADITION!

pathetic.
Barking Carnival — Blog — The Unraveling of the Big 12 said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 2:03 pm

[...] maintaining a principled disregard for offense. But other than A&M’s near miss on an anniversarial moral victory, things are headed in the wrong direction for almost every team in the conference. Take out Texas [...]
James Tanner said:

December 3rd, 2009 at 4:34 pm

Trips- I wasn’t trying to rationalize it. The opposite, really. Y’all are the ones trying to impose a very simple moral judgment on a complex phenomenon. My expertise is in public management. I deal with complex organizational tasks for a living, and it’s not remotely as easy to prevent these kind of things as you’re suggesting. I’ve submitted that this is a case study for organizational blindness, and the moral issues are inherently tricky. Anyone who’s studied the topic would know I’m right. You’ve ignored that argument, presumably because you know little about the study of management. If so, that’s totally fine, most people don’t know jack squat about it, but know your limits.

It’s one thing to say that Aggies like to pinch their nuts and fondle sheep. That’s just fun ‘n games, part of our own tradition really. My granddad was saying the same stuff in the fifties when he went to Texas, and I have the original Aggie Joke Books to prove it. It’s another thing to basically accuse them of murder, when it’s a situation where no one individual was ever in a position to prevent what happened.

I’ll grant this: aTm has a very strong organizational culture, and that’s a massive factor in what happened. But the blameworthy part isn’t strong organizational culture per se. The Japanese have strong organizational culture and their production is generally more reliable than ours. It just makes the management task of setting up operations more critical; if things aren’t set up right at the very outset, things can go horribly wrong down the line. And the study of these kinds of management tasks is a fairly new science; the Bonfire tradition well predates it.

That being said, there’s also just a plain taste issue here, a line I’m not comfortable crossing. And well-composed tastelessness is what makes this site great…at least for me, as long as it doesn’t involve climbing on top of a pile of dead kids to prove your point. But tomato tomahto. This is not my house, I’m the newbie here as a commenter, but a reader from the start and a big fan of your posts, so I’ll stop here. I’m sure Tim is entertaining elsewhere anyways. That dude is AWEsome.
Beergut said:

December 5th, 2009 at 2:31 pm

I read this article and the ensuing comments with great interest. As someone who worked on Bonfire during my four years on campus, I’m sure my views will differ greatly from many of you on here, especially the texas fans.

I will say that a lot of the comments on here from texas fans are based on myths and half-truths that have been repeated and that they’ve taken to be fact, i.e. the jizz jar, the t.u. ‘frat house’ on top of Stack, etc.

Most interesting are AiT’s comments, not because they are wrong, but because they reflect how much Bonfire changed from when he attended A&M in the ’80s to when I attended it in the ’90s. In the ’80s, the building of Bonfire was mainly a project for the Corps of Cadets. I have an uncle who is Class of ‘97; when I asked why he never worked on Bonfire as a student, he said that during his time, it was a Corps thing. When I was there, the Bonfire was almost entirely non-reg run; there were Corps members in leadership positions (redpots and brownpots), but a lot of that had to do with how their pots were handed down (Corps members making sure it was given to another Corps member) rather than reflecting an intense involvement by the Corps. While Bonfire may have been “all about beating t.u.” in the ’80s, in the ’90s, beating t.u. had already become another Aggie tradition. Remember, we grew up with Jackie and then RC prowling the sidelines, we were used to Thanksgiving turkey and watching A&M beat the hell outta texas as our holiday tradition. In the ’90s, Bonfire had grown to be more about the project itself than having anything to do with texas. It was about a group of people from different backgrounds coming together to work on a project that couldn’t be accomplished alone. It was about working hard and having fun, about earning friends through hard work. There were roughly 5,000 students each year who worked on Bonfire, and simple match would tell you times had changed (the Corps was just under 2000 students at that time, so even assuming 100% participation from the Corps, which NEVER happened, you’d still be looking at a non-reg majority in the work effort).

At 5000 students, it is unrealistic to say all of these people were inspired by a ‘hatred’ or ‘desire’ to ‘beat the hell outta t.u.’. Simple logic would tell you that you can’t get that many college students to put in that many work hours simply to build a structure you are going to destroy to honor a rivalry, tradition or no tradition. The fact that so many texas fans believe this so ardently reflects their own self-absorption and institutional conceit. I think many texas fans, for whatever reason, have to believe A&M and Aggies are obsessed with texas, because they think it somehow gives them some cache or relevance, but it simply isn’t true.

There were some students and groups against Bonfire while I was on campus, led by a certain Biology professor who was interviewed in the days after it fell who ran a ‘Bonfire-Dumb As Dirt’ website. This professor was guided by environmental concerns, though; he believed Bonfire cut sites killed an endangered plant he had built his career studying, and became incredibly bitter when his concerns were proven to be wrong, and he was ignored. Faculty and students who spoke out against Bonfire always couched their concerns in the environmental impact it had first, then mentioned students losing sleep and missing class.

I know that there were things that went on in 1999 that had changed from the year before when I worked on it, so to say we had this institutional problem where kids were acting like idiots year after year after year while building Bonfire is disingenuous. There were structural changes in the building in 1999 that led to the collapse that were not part of how we built ii from 1995-98.

The proceeds from the “Burning Desire” documentary DVD are to go to the Bonfire Memorial Fund, so this isn’t an example of athletic department profiteering. I think they grouped the 1999 game DVd with the documentary DVD not to ‘connect’ the game with the tragedy, but in an attempt to sell more DVDs and make more money for the memorial fund.

I was initially concerned when I saw the plans to wear the helmet decals for this game, but I thought it was tastefully done, and underplayed.

I think James Tanner has a good take on the whole incident.

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Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 21 minutes ago

10 point lead for the Mormons again…
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 36 minutes ago

This is the first-time Frank Martin has ever met a Mormon who wasn’t on a bicycle.
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 40 minutes ago

Does that mean he gets to pick his wives first???
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 41 minutes ago

BYU starts a 2-time Utah “Mr. Basketball.” Everything about that sentence kills me.
Sailor Ripley commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 43 minutes ago

The Hickory High Polygamists.
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 43 minutes ago

BTW — is that a white power tattoo on Sasquatch’s right shoulder.

Or is it one of those “native american” side of the van spray paint jobs? Either way it’s better than Luke Walton’s dancing bear.
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 44 minutes ago

Could be a day of mourning for the state of Kansas????
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 44 minutes ago

Good be a day of mourning for the state of Kansas????
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 45 minutes ago

Sasquatch!

By the way, BYU is running a white out and is up 10 – 0 on K-State.
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 47 minutes ago

WOLVERINE!
admin commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 48 minutes ago
Sailor Ripley commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 48 minutes ago

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2010/0320/ncb_g_orear_576.jpg
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 55 minutes ago

Games like that are the reason why every year some secretary who doesn’t like sports wins the pool at my office.
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 57 minutes ago

Yeah, Baylor – St. Mary will be good. I hate Drew, but he’s a good coach.

Self’s players choked. But Northern Iowa is a much, much better team than I thought.
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 2 minutes ago

CJD,

I’m not sure if it’s the worst job, but it’s the most disappointing ending. Talking heads are already calling it the most shocking (i.e. worst) loss in the tournament ever. 05-06, Kansas went down in the first round, but nothing like this……Can we at least call it the worst choke job ever to
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 2 minutes ago

CJD,

I’m not sure if it’s the worst job, but it’s the most disappointing ending. Talking heads are already calling it the most shocking (i.e. worst) loss in the tournament ever. 05-06, Kansas went down in the first round, but nothing like this……Can we at least call it the worst choke job ever, to
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 10 minutes ago

If anyone in the BC bracket called this game they should immediately be hired as an assistant coach. Because that would be an act of pure witchcraft.
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 11 minutes ago

Huskies putting the finishing touches on Steve Alford’s feathers.

I must admit, that I had only watched a bit of the Huskies this year and didn’t hold them in high regard coming into the tourney. They’ve impressed me the first two rounds….That said, UNM was a weak 3 seed, but there are no
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 14 minutes ago

This is the year of the mid-west.
uthookem commented on the blog post Rumor Alert–TMG 1 hour, 19 minutes ago

Yikes, not good for the Big XII, and I really don’t see TMJ going in the first round either, so he isn’t likely to “get paid” regardless.

SHARETHIS.addEntry({ title: ””, url: ”” });
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 20 minutes ago

Also, Baylor has a legit shot to go farther. It’s set up nicely for them.
uthookem commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 20 minutes ago

Glad I only had KU winning in one of my five brackets…now the other four really have a chance!
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 21 minutes ago

Okay, that was worth my brackets going up in smoke…..BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 22 minutes ago

UNI makes 1 of these FTs and it’s over….
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 23 minutes ago

Lomers is the difference in getting Baylor to the sweet sixteen, while Dexter is hitting the chunky monkey ice cream…..Life, ain’t it funky???
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 23 minutes ago

Yeah, my bracket is f#$ked.

So be it. It’s fun to watch how good these mid-major teams are. Upsets used to all be the same — a smaller team gets hot and hits 3s. Not now. These mid-majors flat-out beat highly ranked teams now.
Patrick Bateman commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 25 minutes ago

There goes my bracket…..
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 25 minutes ago

Agreed. That’s why Dex would have fouled out. Shot-blocking is much less important that not allowing the other team to get into comfortable low post/rebounding position.
uthookem commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 26 minutes ago

Awesome. KU is only going to make it one round farther than we did.

The karma ship is beginning to right itself.
ghostofagroundgame commented on the blog post NCAA Tournament Open Thread: Weekend Edition 1 hour, 26 minutes ago

NI is going to win it.

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