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Musings on Mangino: The Future of KU Football

Posted by Scipio Tex on November 19th, 2009 under Football

Our KU friend Hiphopopotamus free-styled some brilliance on this subject yesterday and it’s an absolute must-read if you want to understand why Mangino’s days are numbered. KU AD Lew Perkins (himself a former 400 pounder – what is the Jayhawk fascination with gluttony?) is making a paper trail that Hansel and Gretel couldn’t miss.

What will seal it for Mangino is the piling on of former players. Once a process takes on a certain momentum and the public perception of the coach becomes calcified, there’s nothing to be done.

To wit:

Former Kansas wide receiver Raymond Brown, a senior last season, said Mangino would often “say personal, hurtful, embarrassing things in front of people.” Brown cited two examples. He said that once, his younger brother had been shot in the arm in St. Louis. Then came a game. I dropped a pass and [Mangino] was mad,” Brown said. “And I said, ‘Yes, sir. Yes, sir.’ The yelling didn’t bother me. But then he said, ‘Shut up!’ He said, ‘If you don’t shut up, I’m going to send you back to St. Louis so you can get shot with your homies.

I once asked Henry James this very question below:

Brown said another teammate had confided in the team that his father was an alcoholic and the player dreamed of becoming a lawyer. One day, [Mangino] said in front of the entire team, ‘Are you going to be a lawyer or do you want to become an alcoholic like your Dad?’ ” Brown said.

Except instead of alcoholic, I used the word pederast. And instead of your Dad, I used the words “your local mailman.” And instead of lawyer, I used the words “moderately successful financial services professional.” So in retrospect, I asked him a very different question.

When bleed-for-the-program types like former LB Joe Mortensen turn on you, you’re truly done:

[Mangino] was ruthless, to be honest with you. What goes around, comes around,” Mortensen said. “We were afraid if we said something he would hurt us with the [pro] scouts. But these incidents were day after day after day for years. And now it’s finally coming out. Mortensen said Mangino told him he had been a bad friend to someone who had died. And that Mangino would repeatedly bring up his public intoxication citation. He told me he’d send me back to Oakland where I could be drinking out of a brown paper bag,” Mortensen said. “He told me, ‘You were a s—- friend to someone I knew that passed away.’ He called me a bum. He showed me no respect. He told me he’d send me back to the ghetto.

Lots of threats in this article about “sending players back to ghettoes” from Mangino. Very Himmler. But ghettoes can be a happy place. Didn’t he ever watch Good Times?

So what does Mangino say in his defense?

I have been in this conference for nearly 20 years, and what I can tell you is that our coaching intensity does not largely differ from the other Big Eight and Big 12 teams that I have observed. We have handled this program in terms of intensity and holding players accountable the same since 2002 to today. Nothing’s changed. Absolutely nothing has changed.

Every word Mangino just said above is probably true. Care to guess the programs he observed prior to coming to Kansas? KSU under Bill Snyder and OU under Bob Stoops. Fruit doesn’t fall far from the coaching tree.

He’s done.

So what does it mean for Kansas? The Kansas is now doomed and will return to total football irrelevance default internet opinion strikes me as Ill-Informed and Reactionary – the internet Pikeys’ two favorite coursing hounds. Hiring coaches is a risky business, but Kansas is still a reasonable Division I job and Glen Mason had a little success there before Terry Allen transformed KU again into a gridiron wasteland. With Mangino’s bowl success and that magical 12-1 season, the school has been fundamentally changed in its culture and approach to that pesky Fall gap between basketball seasons. They now see football as a necessary and desirable endeavor, worthy of support and financing.

I’d call Turner Gill. He knows the terrain and he strikes me as ready. Maybe Kansans want John Riggins. I don’t know their favorite sons. As long as the next coach does Px-90 and has no history of berating parking attendants, they’re off to a good start. If they make a solid hire, they’ll be just fine. If they don’t, they’re done for ten years.

Part II is here.

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28 Responses

  1. bigdukesix said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 5:26 pm

    He told me he’d send me back to Oakland where I could be drinking out of a brown paper bag,” Mortensen said.

    What makes this even worse is that Mortensen isn’t even from Oakland to begin with.

  2. gingerballs said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 5:34 pm

    What makes this even worse is that Mortensen isn’t even from Oakland to begin with.

    Concord is a suburb of Oakland

  3. bigdukesix said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 5:39 pm

    It’s a suburb of Oakland, but it’s considerably nicer. It was a poor attempt at a joke on my part.

  4. ACE said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 5:45 pm


    Kansas native.

  5. NY Horn said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 5:49 pm

    They need someone with Texas connections. I doubt Sumler even returns their calls though.

  6. texastough said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:13 pm

    Anyone see the article that the big Man is getting booted because of his weight, because his weight makes him depressed, which makes him negative, which makes him moody and volatile, which makes him angry, which makes him threaten to abuse everyone under him like threatening to send his heisman candidate QB to the set of Boyz in the Hood? Solution (and I’m dead serious) – Mangino is the ambassador that brings american football and sumo culture together. Immovable object, unstoppable force, etc. They pay by the pound in Japan. Mangino’s happy. Team Japan plays pro-bowlers in the World Football Classic. Everyone wins.

  7. admin said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:18 pm

    jason whitlock is sleepy

    Jason Whitlock woke up and wrote that article.

  8. Scipio Tex said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:20 pm

    bigduke -

    I live here. Parts of Concord are real bad. Four Corners is a staple of the evening news. FWIW.

    NYHorn -

    KU is a better job than U of H. You think Kevin is holding out for something bigger?

    texastough –

    That was a Whitlock article. I actually thought it had some compelling ideas though in typical Whitlock fashion he can’t nail even his good ideas down and he tends to extrapolate his own experiences to others like some universal truth.

  9. srr50 said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:23 pm

    We have been through this with our very own (thinner) Mangino.

    Bob Weltlich

  10. fitzhume said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:23 pm

    Interesting idea, but my limited knowledge of Japanese culture (watching 3/5 of “Shogun” and 2/3 of the Karate Kid movies when I was younger) tells me that there would not be a whole lot of tolerance for a fat American white guy that doesn’t pay parking tickets.

  11. texastough said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:25 pm

    I nailed it down for him.

  12. TaylorTRoom said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:31 pm

    I don’t see any way KU can get it together enough to give Texas a game. How much trust can there be right now between the staff and players? If Mangino is fired tomorrow, how many assistants are not equally reviled?

  13. Scipio Tex said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:34 pm

    In an abusive household, children resent the parent who denies and tolerates it just as much as the parent dishing out the beatings.

  14. fitzhume said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 6:38 pm

    Is there word yet on whether Mangino will be on the sidelines Saturday? I assume so, but has that been established for certain?

  15. Hiphopopotamus said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 7:39 pm

    In an abusive household, children resent the parent who denies and tolerates it just as much as the parent dishing out the beatings.

    Having known a handful of players over the Mangino years, I can say that it doesn’t translate in this case. That 2007 team all knew Bill Young should have been their head coach and would fight to the death for him. And even still today, you wouldn’t find a guy on the team that doesn’t love his position coach. Mostly, because the coaches take it just as bad if not worse than the players.

  16. java said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 7:44 pm

    If Mangino is on the sidelines, it will be interesting to see if any assistants are willing to associate with him. I would think they will be trying to distance themselves from the pariah.

    Anxiously awaiting news of passengers on the team plane here.

  17. Scipio Tex said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 8:07 pm

    Mangino hired a lawyer and they’re talking buyout.

    http://oreadboomkings.fantake.com/2009/11/19/the-mark-mangino-timeline-at-kansas/

  18. Gene Claude said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 8:52 pm

    Scip, speaking from an intensely personal viewpoint, this is what we like to call a false dichotomy:

    ‘Are you going to be a lawyer or do you want to become an alcoholic like your Dad?’

  19. Dennis The Menace said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 9:05 pm

    There are very strong rumblings that Franchione will be back on the sidelines at Texas State next year. Brad Wright is in the final year of his contract and has not been offered an extension. People who knew Fran when he was there say he loved the environment there and the town loved him. He hated the scrutiny at Bama. Look for him to take a low profile job if he comes back.

  20. SpiralOut said:

    November 19th, 2009 at 9:31 pm

    Px-90?

    I guess that means Scipio is also a bit on the rotund side and just likes to act like he knows the Downward Dog, Ball Kick, and Airborne Heisman.

  21. wisconsinhornybadger said:

    November 20th, 2009 at 9:28 am

    too bad mangino was too fat to attract a sally brown who would tell him its not nice to berate your players every day

  22. SL Xpress said:

    November 20th, 2009 at 9:32 am

    The Kansas football coach is paid $2.3 million, and is the 16th highest paid coach in the country.

    They’ve upgraded their facilities tremendously, and there is an emphasis on football from the athletic department. I bet Kevin Sumlin takes that gig in a heartbeat. Frankly, I think there’s going to be a lot of interest in that job. My favorite choice would be Gary Patterson. Sure, he’s a good coach, but that’s not it. He turned down the Kansas State job when given an opportunity to coach there, so I think the dynamics would be amusing if he then turned around and took the Kansas job instead.

  23. Scipio Tex said:

    November 20th, 2009 at 10:10 am

    Hiphop -

    Thanks for the clarification. Pure ignorant conjecture on my part.

    Gene Claude -

    Right. The question should have been: Do you want to be a lawyer AND a drunk like your father?

    Dennis -

    That’s probably a fantastic job for him, actually.

    SpiralOut -

    Yes, yes. That’s the only possible interpretation of what transposing a letter could mean.

    SL Express -

    Good to see you, man. The beauty of paying Mangino that amount is that means this money is already “in the budget” and if you know anything about bureaucracies, that’s a number that’s not going down if it doesn’t have to do so. There’s no question that Sumlin would take that gig, IMO. I wonder if he could lure Jeffcoat there.

    Patterson has to make some interesting choices soon. There’s a lot to be said for being the bully toad in a small pond. And he’d be recruiting the same exact players at Kansas as at TCU.

  24. Hiphopopotamus said:

    November 20th, 2009 at 12:20 pm

    SL Express – I’m glad to hear that from someone without an inherent bias. Hope you’re right.

  25. TaylorTRoom said:

    November 20th, 2009 at 12:32 pm

    Did Mangino get on the plane?

  26. lorne michaels said:

    November 20th, 2009 at 12:37 pm

    I figured out where Mangino got his motivational skills:

  27. Gene Claude said:

    November 20th, 2009 at 7:58 pm

    I think the correct statement is “do you want to be a lawyer so that you fit in better when you end up a drunk like your dad?”

  28. Barking Carnival — Blog — The Disciplinarians: Pinkel and Mangino said:

    November 24th, 2009 at 8:31 am

    [...] a stern father-figure, he was being a petty tyrant. (Scipio brilliantly analyzes this distinction here and here). I am not here to condone these alleged actions. Still, you know what, if you take the top [...]

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