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The Big 12 is now the best conference in college football

Posted by BRAGGonUT on September 17th, 2008 under Football

Get used to it, SEC fans. OK, I actually think the Big 12 deserves a meaningful discussion with the SEC, but since every SEC blogger and bulletin board posse have set Google Alerts for all discussions regarding best conference, I figured I’d poke them in the eye so their dander would be up by the time they made it over to Barking Carnival to defend their flag. I do expect that by the end of the year, the Big 12 does win the horse race for the 2008 season.

For purposes of this discussion, I am only talking about 2008 performance.

Tale of the Tape

The SEC and the Big 12 both boast five 3-0 teams and three 2-0 teams.

Advantage: Push

The Big 12 sports a 28-4 non-conference record (87.5%) while the SEC sports a 23-3 (88%) non-conference record. Each conference really only has one bad non-conference loss: Mississippi State to Louisiana Tech and Texas A&M to Arkansas State.

Advantage: Push


For reference, and to mock the other BCS conferences, and to let them wonder if they really deserve their automatic BCS bowl tie-in, here are their non-conference records:

Big 10 25-6 (very respectable, but still just 1-3 in their Top 25 games)
ACC 17-8
Big East 10-9
Pac 10 14-14

The Big 12 has four of the top 11 in the AP Poll, and five in the top 19. The SEC has five of the top 10 in the AP Poll. My personal poll has the SEC with four of the top 9 and the Big 12 with four of the top 8.

Advantage: Slight SEC

The SEC has four and the Big 12 has five non-conference wins over other BCS conference foes (in my order of impressiveness for the conference):

Big 12 – Missouri over Illinois, 52-42 neutral site
SEC – Alabama over Clemson, 34-10 neutral site
Big 12 – Baylor over Washington State, 45-17
Big 12 – Oklahoma over Washington, 55-14 on road
Big 12 – Oklahoma over Cincinnati, 52-26
SEC – Florida over Miami, 26-3
SEC – South Carolina over North Carolina State, 34-0
Big 12 – Oklahoma State over Washington State, 39-13 on road
SEC – Kentucky over Louisville, 27-2

Advantage: Big 12

Both conferences have bottom 3 programs (Baylor, Ole Miss) with losses to Wake Forest. Tennessee’s loss to UCLA looks worse today than it did on Labor Day after UCLA turned around and got decked by BYU 59-0. Plus, Tennessee is supposed to be middle of the pack in the SEC.

Advantage: Push

Top 20 Total Defenses:
Florida #3 – 190 ypg
Kansas State #6 – 198 ypg
Auburn #10 – 214 ypg
LSU #12 – 219 ypg
Alabama #13 – 221 ypg
Oklahoma #17 – 233 ypg
Mississippi State #20 – 244 ypg

Advantage: SEC

Top 20 Scoring Defenses:
Auburn #3 – 5.0 ppg
Kentucky #5 – 6.3 ppg
Florida #6 – 6.5 ppg
Alabama #9 – 7.7 ppg
Kansas State #T10 – 8.0 ppg
LSU #T10 – 8.0 ppg
Texas #17 – 11.5 ppg
Mississippi State #18 – 11.7 ppg

Advantage: SEC

Top 20 Total Offenses:
Missouri #1 – 597 ypg
Texas Tech #2 – 584 ypg
Oklahoma #5 – 557 ypg
Oklahoma State #6 – 546 ypg
Kansas State #18 – 476 ypg
Highest rated SEC team is Tennessee at #23

Advantage: Big 12

Top 20 Scoring Offenses:
Missouri #1 – 58 ppg
Kansas State #3 – 57 ppg
Oklahoma #5 – 55 ppg
Oklahoma State #6 – 51 ppg
Texas #10 – 47 ppg
Texas Tech #15 – 42 ppg
Highest rated SEC teams are Florida and LSU at #21

Advantage: Big 12

Overall Advantage: PUSH

This week’s game should prove a lot with several Big 12 teams facing over BCS conference schools. The SEC ramps up its conference slate but does have two teams facing BCS conference opponents in Georgia @ Arizona State and Mississippi State @ Georgia Tech.

Tonight
Kansas State at Louisville (ESPN2) 7:00 p.m.

Thursday, Sept. 18
#22 West Virginia at Colorado (ESPN) 7:30 p.m.

Friday, Sept. 19
Baylor at Connecticut (ESPN2) 7:00 p.m.

Saturday, Sept. 20
Buffalo at #5 Missouri 1:00 p.m.
Miami (Fla.) at Texas A&M (ABC) 2:30 p.m.
Rice at #7 Texas (FSN) 6:00 p.m.
Sam Houston State at #19 Kansas (FCS) 6:00 p.m.
Massachusetts at #10 Texas Tech 6:00 p.m.
Iowa State at UNLV (MTN) 8:00 p.m.

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27 Responses

  1. srr50 said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 9:41 am

    The Big 12 sports a 28-4 non-conference record (87.5%) while the SEC sports a 23-3 (88%) non-conference record

    Let’s knock out the 1-AA opponents. The records are still impressive, Big 12 is 20-4 and the SEC is 16-3.

    But is also means that 25% of the Big 12 and 27% of the SEC schedules so far have been D 1-AA and that’s pathetic. Especially when compared to the number of games they play against other BCS schools.

  2. HenryJames said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 9:42 am

    I hope Tony Barnhart kicks your ass.

  3. steven said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 10:08 am

    Aside from Missouri being better than they usually are and Kansas not totally sucking, how has the B12 changed from the past in any significant degree. I suppose you could say that because all the other conferences seem to be sucking ass right now, that sort of makes the B12 better in a relative sense, but aside from those other considerations, I do not see how the B12 is, in actuality, any better than it usually is. Now it may seem to be better cause other conferences suck more, but than really is not being better, at least not in the strict sense of the term.

  4. Black Scholes said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 10:49 am

    Tight End: Neither recruited one.

    Advantage: aggy

  5. BRAGGonUT said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 10:57 am

    I almost made that reference, Black Scholes.

    Nice find, HJ. I wish I had seen that.

  6. Gene Claude said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 12:27 pm

    Steven:

    Baylor is better than it has been.

    Iowa State is better than it has been the last two years.

    Kansas State is better than it was last year.

    Texas Tech is better than it has been in many years.

    Oklahoma and Missouri are legit national title contenders, and Texas may end up in the discussion.

    There are no bad teams in the Big 12 this year. There is a good chance the conference has 9 or 10 bowl eligible teams. There are 4 teams that will have good cases for top 10 status all year, and 8 that do or could have legit top 25 aspirations all year(OK, UT, TT, MU, KU, OSU, KSU, NU).

    There are only 2 teams that are worse this year than last…A&M and KU, and KU is still very good.

    And, most importantly, we automatically expel teams that play 3 – 2 thrillers.

    I don’t necessarily care which conference is better, and the SEC wins hands down long term, but this year, it is a fair debate.

  7. Phenomenal Smith said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 12:47 pm

    The Big 12 also has superior college QBs. Some might say vastly superior. One tidbit that goes a long way in my opinion is that of the top seven active career leaders in pass efficiency, six are in the Big 12. That’s right. 6 of the top 7. The list goes:

    Bradford, Colt, Rudy Carpenter, Graham Harrell, Zac Robinson, Todd Reesing, and Chase Daniel.

    http://web1.ncaa.org/mfb/2008/Internet/career/careerPassB15.html

    There is not an SEC QB in the top 20. 2008 is the year of the Big 12. Enjoy.

  8. Scipio Tex said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 2:39 pm

    That’s where I see the big difference as well. I also see it as a one or two year phenomenon before the SEC reasserts itself.

    QB play. The modern college game is in the hands of your QB in a way it has never been in football history.

    One thing I think most would agree on – there’s a hell of a lot space between the SEC/Big 12 and the rest of college football right now.

  9. BRAGGonUT said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 2:54 pm

    Oh, don’t take my post as anything other than a discussion of this year. The SEC’s built-in advantages over every other conference actually extended their lead with the SEC TV deal with ESPN. Water finds it level and the SEC being the premier football league will find its level.

    Until the Big 12 cuts a legitimate bigtime TV deal, it will play second fiddle and its onlt hope is to outperform expectations on any year. Like this one.

  10. Bartoncreek said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 3:15 pm

    The QB play in the Big 12 is sick this year.
    Daniel
    Bradford
    Reesing
    Colt
    Harrell
    Robinson
    Ganz
    Freeman
    Griffin
    Hawkins

    That’s 10 above average to great college QBs. Hell, Freeman will probably be drafted fairly high and he wouldn’t break anyone’s top 6 in the Big 12. I think it is safe to say that those 10 would start at every SEC school save Georgia and Florida. We pawned off a 2nd teamer to Ole Miss and he is now probably the 3rd best QB in the SEC.

  11. BRAGGonUT said:

    September 17th, 2008 at 6:08 pm

    Clearly I jinxed Kansas State and the conference.

  12. Gene Claude said:

    September 18th, 2008 at 5:39 am

    Kansas State jinxed itself by signing Prince to an extension. And by “jinxed” I mean “fucked.”

  13. coach Callahan said:

    September 18th, 2008 at 6:57 am

    Kstate has now finished their decent back to the bottom of division 1 football. Maybe athletic directors should sign coaches to extensions after successful years only.

  14. Facebook User said:

    September 18th, 2008 at 7:29 am


    Kstate has now finished their decent back to the bottom of division 1 football.

  15. Gene Claude said:

    September 18th, 2008 at 7:56 am

    But Nebraska has not yet finished their ascent into literacy.

  16. coach Callahan said:

    September 18th, 2008 at 9:31 am

    and we never plan to.

  17. Robert said:

    September 18th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    The Big 12 is stacked on offense this year. SEC is better on overall defensive talent. But both leagues lap the rest of college football. Is it really possible that the Mountain West is the third best conference?

  18. Habbit said:

    September 27th, 2008 at 6:05 am

    This is getting old. Please stop hyping up your non-SEC teams, Big 10, Big 12, WAC, whatever because each year the SEC blows out and embarrasses your teams in bowl games.

    You are right: Missouri and Chase Daniels have been looking really good so far… Then again, Hawaii and Colt Brennan were supposed to lose a very close game to Georgia. … … … Buahahaha!

  19. Ojnab Bob said:

    September 27th, 2008 at 7:13 am

    Habbit, before the Fall of the Husker Empire in 2002, I recall routinely manhandling the SEC champions in our bowl game 7 times in a row from 1980-2000… ancient history at this point to everyone else, I imagine, but you’ll forgive me for not prostrating myself at the altar of the holy SEC.

    2000/01/02 Nebraska 31 – Tennessee 21 W Fiesta Bowl

    1998/01/02 Nebraska 42 – Tennessee 17 W Orange Bowl

    1996/01/02 Nebraska 62 – Florida 24 W Fiesta Bowl

    1987/01/01 Nebraska 30 – LSU 15 W Sugar Bowl

    1985/01/01 Nebraska 28 – LSU 10 W Sugar Bowl

    1983/01/01 Nebraska 21 – LSU 20 W Orange Bowl

    1980/12/27 Nebraska 31 – Mississippi St 17 W Sun Bowl

  20. Habbit said:

    September 27th, 2008 at 10:45 am

    Ojnab Bob, I don’t forgive you, because you’re purposely giving us statistics during Golden Years of your favorite school to the down years of the SEC counterparts. Are you honestly copy/pasting scores from 1980?

    12/27/2002 Mississippi 27 – Nebraska 23 Independence Bowl
    01/01/2007 Auburn 17 – Nebraska 14
    Cotton Bowl

    Not exactly blowouts, but the first team they lost to was Ole Miss who, until recently, playing was considered the same thing as having a bye-week. SEC 2, Nebraska 0 in the 21st century. I’m sure the trend will continue.

    All that and my first post never even mentioned a specific non-SEC schools’ mild success against the Southeastern Conference; I called out every other conference out as a whole!

    The fact of the matter is, in our current time period (have to mention that so you don’t reminisce about the Glory Days), the top-tier SEC (Florida, LSU, Auburn, Georgia, and now Alabama) and middle-of-the-pack SEC teams (Vanderbilt, Tennessee, and South Carolina) will consistently destroy any top-tier teams in any other conference and the scraps of the SEC (Ole Miss, Arkansas, Mississippi State, and Kentucky) could become top-tier competitors in any other conference if they were to switch.

    Of the twelve teams in the Big 12, two (Oklahoma and Texas) have a remotely possible competing chance with the top and middle SEC teams, but we’ve seen in the RECENT past that they are likely to turn out to be pathetic choke artists. Missouri is still on the fence, as it’s very possible they will become garbage again after Chase Daniel graduates.

    Your conference, as of now, has four teams in the top 10, but only one of those teams (Missouri) has played anyone other than a high school girls soccer team, although Oklahoma does play #24 TCU (hahaha) tonight. Georgia whipped PAC-10 opponents, ASU, and has the toughest schedule in the nation, as they play FIVE currently ranked teams, who ALL happen to be SEC teams. Florida slaughtered last year’s Sugar Bowl contenders Hawaii (who were also slaughtered by an SEC team in that game) and they destroyed two other teams with a legacy of winning: Miami and Tennessee. LSU has already played a ranked team; Auburn, former #10, who lost to the National Champions. Alabama wasted a ranked Clemson team who was supposed to dominate college football this year and they play the #3 ranked, but most talented football team in college football, tonight.

    It’s sad the question of the best conference is being asked… this question would be considered a joke if any other conference had won the last two national titles and had half of the top 10 teams in their conference! At least let the Big 12 get to .500 in BCS National Championship Games (they’re 2-3) before you start pulling out your dick!

    And for my last point, Big East commissioner Mike Tranghese said it best, “You remember a couple of years ago people were saying the SEC is down? I laughed at that. I mean, to think, I don’t know what being down in the SEC means. You don’t send 20 players to the NFL? You send 10?”

    If you’re the best conference in college football, you don’t send only four players in the first round of draft to the NFL, you send eleven players. Guess who sent who?

    No need to run to the alter too quickly.

  21. Ojnab Bob said:

    September 27th, 2008 at 11:06 am

    Habiit, I don’t think there is any debate that the SEC has been the best conference in college football this decade, and I actually agree with many of your points. I also agree that the SEC probably is the best again this season, although 1) the season is still young, and 2) the gap has narrowed.

    I think my objection is to some of your more incendiary suggestions: “Of the twelve teams in the Big 12, two (Oklahoma and Texas) have a remotely possible competing chance with the top and middle SEC teams.” Do you seriously believe that mighty Vanderbilt, Tennessee or even Auburn really would dominate this year’s Oklahama squad? That statement is just hard to support with any rational evidence.

    You also seem to be placing an inordinate amount of weight on a victory over a Hawaii team organized as if it was a touch-football team; I might de-emphasize that in the future.

    My last point would be to encourage you to moderate your message a bit. All this overwrought SEC chest-beating has a way of alienating otherwise objective fans…

  22. Habbit said:

    September 27th, 2008 at 2:26 pm

    Ojnab Bob, I do, and I’m surprised you would pick Oklahoma to represent your post as they are decidedly biggest choke artists of this decade.

    Vanderbilt has always had good teams and talented players and their schedule is just as tough as Oklahoma and Texas’… yet they are only decent team in the SEC, whereas the Sooners and Longhorns are at the very top.

    As far as Tennessee goes, they have potential and talent out of this world… I have no idea why they have been so awful this year. I’m sure you could agree with that, as well.

    Auburn would humiliate Oklahoma. The former National oh-my-God-they-are-freaking-monsters Champions were only able to score 26 points on the Tiger’s defense, while they scored 41 in their two previous games, and Oklahoma looks like a practice squad compared to LSU.

    Do you seriously believe that mighty Oklahoma really would dominate this year’s Auburn squad? None of your statements have been supported with any rational evidence.

    You also seem to have read two or three sentences from my previous post; you should de-emphasize that in the future. I mentioned Hawaii twice: once in my first post and once in my second, was there any reason for you to bring them up again?

    I would appreciate it if you responded to my statements, rather than complain about the way I reply to your grossly inaccurate statements. You pleasantly ignore the fact that I have agreed that Missouri is a good football team and I also have no problem with any school from the Big 12; I actually enjoy watching Texas and Oklahoma play. I was born in Colorado, and one of my best friends plays for Nebraska. It’s the ‘overwrought chest-beating’ of Big 12 fans whose conference has had ONE good season as a WHOLE conference.

  23. Habbit said:

    September 27th, 2008 at 2:29 pm

    …that is pretty irritating.

  24. Ojnab Bob said:

    September 27th, 2008 at 3:06 pm

    Habbit, I don’t recall posting any pro-Big 12 taunts on a SEC football discussion site. While how we got here is strange, I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree on the relative merits of Oklahoma-Auburn, Bob Stoops’ egglaying in BCS games notwithstanding. I do believe OU would win by 14-17 on a neutral field over Auburn and would beat Vanderbilt by 28-31. Texas certainly handled the Hogs at least as easily as Alabama.

    It’s hard to say how good Missouri is right now… they may be good, great or 1988 Oklahoma State redux (great o, terrible D).

    Perhaps this debate is best tabled for resumption in December, when the season has played itself out and we’ll have more facts relevant to this season to discuss. I don’t see us getting anywhere here until then.

  25. Ojnab Bob said:

    September 27th, 2008 at 3:16 pm

    And I do agree with you re Tennessee – they should beat UCLA 98 times out of 100. Their season so far is puzzling, although they apparently played more to their potential today.

  26. Habbit said:

    September 29th, 2008 at 9:26 pm

    Ojnab Bob, the entire first paragraph of this blog pretty much invites SEC fans to show up and educate Mr. BRAGGonUT on the realities of college football.

    It would be best if we waited until December, but then there would be no mystery and hostility because all of the answers would be revealed! =)

    I do believe that as the season progresses and injuries begin to mount we will definitely notice the lack of team depth in every conference aside from the SEC.

  27. Trent Villarreal said:

    January 10th, 2009 at 6:53 am

    hi
    66xlumgve0e9025k
    good luck

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