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	<title>Comments on: The History of College Football Recruiting Cheating- Part 4</title>
	<atom:link href="http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/</link>
	<description>Texas Longhorns and sports</description>
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		<title>By: ponderos</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-49834</link>
		<dc:creator>ponderos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Jul 2009 03:20:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-49834</guid>
		<description>I bet an Okie State fan did it in crayon, too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I bet an Okie State fan did it in crayon, too.</p>
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		<title>By: Plano Jeff</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-49828</link>
		<dc:creator>Plano Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Jul 2009 01:40:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-49828</guid>
		<description>Excellent reading. If you do take on OU, the OSU people had a great chart a few years back chronicling the OU scandals. It is hillarious and I can&#039;t find it on the web to save my life, but I&#039;d bet an Okie State fan would send you one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent reading. If you do take on OU, the OSU people had a great chart a few years back chronicling the OU scandals. It is hillarious and I can&#8217;t find it on the web to save my life, but I&#8217;d bet an Okie State fan would send you one.</p>
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		<title>By: TaylorTRoom</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-49729</link>
		<dc:creator>TaylorTRoom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:09:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-49729</guid>
		<description>Thanks for reading, Ed.  I wrote about TAMU and Bryant because my research indicates that TAMU may have been paying players in the &#039;50s, but not really that much worse than many competitors (such as SMU).  Why did the conference turn on them?  I suspect it was due to a sense that they &quot;didn&#039;t know their place&quot; when they were recruiting other areas.  50 years later, TAMU is understood to be a state-wide recruiter and would not attract the same scorn from their peers.

As for TAMU&#039;s appeal in the &#039;50s, you have to remember that we are not talking about the appeal to dedicated future academics, or agriculturists, but to star HS football player, which is a different thing altogether.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for reading, Ed.  I wrote about TAMU and Bryant because my research indicates that TAMU may have been paying players in the &#8217;50s, but not really that much worse than many competitors (such as SMU).  Why did the conference turn on them?  I suspect it was due to a sense that they &#8220;didn&#8217;t know their place&#8221; when they were recruiting other areas.  50 years later, TAMU is understood to be a state-wide recruiter and would not attract the same scorn from their peers.</p>
<p>As for TAMU&#8217;s appeal in the &#8217;50s, you have to remember that we are not talking about the appeal to dedicated future academics, or agriculturists, but to star HS football player, which is a different thing altogether.</p>
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		<title>By: ed</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-49723</link>
		<dc:creator>ed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:00:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-49723</guid>
		<description>Interesting subject and some great information. Some questions/comments:

1. I wonder -- why choose Bear Bryant and Texas A&amp;M as your only detailed example? The SMU and TCU play-for-pay issues in the 1980s are much more relevant in time and detail.

2. I think it&#039;s unfair to say A&amp;M was not attractive to prospective recruits in 1955 because it was an all male school with required ROTC. Those might be negatives today; they were a lot less significant 50-plus years ago.

3. It is inaccurate to say the state was &quot;carved up&quot; regionally. In fact, TCU prospered by recruiting mega talent from East and West Texas -- far from the Fort Worth area. Jess Neely and his Rice staff covered major portions of the state with their recruiting. Of course SMU, TCU and Rice got a larger percentage of players from their hometowns; Texas does the same thing today with the Austin area. This is not &quot;carving up&quot; the state, thus leaving the small towns to A&amp;M and Baylor. Texas A&amp;M got a lot of small-town athletes (and students as a whole); it was THE place to study agriculture, and many of those students were from rural towns. That&#039;s where farms and ranches are.

4. As pointed out in one of the comments, it was the norm at the time for the conference to clean up its problems and mete out punishment. It wasn&#039;t until ADs and faculty reps decided to distance themselved from the lawyering and judging of their members that conferences kicked those things to higher authority (the NCAA).

5. I won&#039;t even get into the &quot;worth of degrees.&quot; I&#039;ve known geniuses from Texas A&amp;I and Texas-El Paso (not picking on anybody here), and dunces from UT and Harvard (or here).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting subject and some great information. Some questions/comments:</p>
<p>1. I wonder &#8212; why choose Bear Bryant and Texas A&amp;M as your only detailed example? The SMU and TCU play-for-pay issues in the 1980s are much more relevant in time and detail.</p>
<p>2. I think it&#8217;s unfair to say A&amp;M was not attractive to prospective recruits in 1955 because it was an all male school with required ROTC. Those might be negatives today; they were a lot less significant 50-plus years ago.</p>
<p>3. It is inaccurate to say the state was &#8220;carved up&#8221; regionally. In fact, TCU prospered by recruiting mega talent from East and West Texas &#8212; far from the Fort Worth area. Jess Neely and his Rice staff covered major portions of the state with their recruiting. Of course SMU, TCU and Rice got a larger percentage of players from their hometowns; Texas does the same thing today with the Austin area. This is not &#8220;carving up&#8221; the state, thus leaving the small towns to A&amp;M and Baylor. Texas A&amp;M got a lot of small-town athletes (and students as a whole); it was THE place to study agriculture, and many of those students were from rural towns. That&#8217;s where farms and ranches are.</p>
<p>4. As pointed out in one of the comments, it was the norm at the time for the conference to clean up its problems and mete out punishment. It wasn&#8217;t until ADs and faculty reps decided to distance themselved from the lawyering and judging of their members that conferences kicked those things to higher authority (the NCAA).</p>
<p>5. I won&#8217;t even get into the &#8220;worth of degrees.&#8221; I&#8217;ve known geniuses from Texas A&amp;I and Texas-El Paso (not picking on anybody here), and dunces from UT and Harvard (or here).</p>
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		<title>By: Sarge</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-14853</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jul 2008 04:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-14853</guid>
		<description>Please keep going, this is very interesting stuff.  Some I have heard before, most in new.
More please!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please keep going, this is very interesting stuff.  Some I have heard before, most in new.<br />
More please!</p>
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		<title>By: AggieGunnerFan</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-14211</link>
		<dc:creator>AggieGunnerFan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jun 2008 16:48:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-14211</guid>
		<description>Very interesting series on the subject.  Hopefully, you are planning on more because the SMU scandal would be great.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting series on the subject.  Hopefully, you are planning on more because the SMU scandal would be great.</p>
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		<title>By: Lowery</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-14034</link>
		<dc:creator>Lowery</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 02:24:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-14034</guid>
		<description>Very interesting and enjoyable read.  I particularly like the regional aspect that you mentioned.

Funny thing about that if you want to get in the way-back machine with me for a minute.

Picture my room at the fraternity house at Alabama 95ish.  I know that it was some time after lunch because I was in a fog that only week old hunch punch, and Mrs Ps burgers can induce.

On the tv, Dan Patrick is talking about &quot;Tractor Trailer&quot;&#039;s suburban up at Michigan, and what an affront it is.  As I gaze to my right, out the window, I can see Dwayne Rudd finishing up a nice detailing job on both his new jeep, and his new mustang.  He was a really good linebacker and stuff.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting and enjoyable read.  I particularly like the regional aspect that you mentioned.</p>
<p>Funny thing about that if you want to get in the way-back machine with me for a minute.</p>
<p>Picture my room at the fraternity house at Alabama 95ish.  I know that it was some time after lunch because I was in a fog that only week old hunch punch, and Mrs Ps burgers can induce.</p>
<p>On the tv, Dan Patrick is talking about &#8220;Tractor Trailer&#8221;&#8217;s suburban up at Michigan, and what an affront it is.  As I gaze to my right, out the window, I can see Dwayne Rudd finishing up a nice detailing job on both his new jeep, and his new mustang.  He was a really good linebacker and stuff.</p>
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		<title>By: SeeingRed</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-14029</link>
		<dc:creator>SeeingRed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:38:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-14029</guid>
		<description>Barry Switzer cheated on a sperm test.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barry Switzer cheated on a sperm test.</p>
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		<title>By: TaylorTRoom</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-14020</link>
		<dc:creator>TaylorTRoom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 17:18:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-14020</guid>
		<description>Nate, I&#039;ve read his book, &quot;Breaking the Ice&quot;, and it is a very fair account of a tragic time.  Don&#039;t make the mistake a lot of Sooners do of assuming Oklahoma football were necessarily angels in this deal.

Give Wilkinson credit for integrating in the &#039;50s.  Note also that the Big 6 conference had been integrated for awhile already.  Also note that he stopped integrating, and why.

Also, in your article, did you note the comments about the Arkansas 1965 football staff, and how cruel it could be?  You do know who were assistants on that staff, don&#039;t you?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nate, I&#8217;ve read his book, &#8220;Breaking the Ice&#8221;, and it is a very fair account of a tragic time.  Don&#8217;t make the mistake a lot of Sooners do of assuming Oklahoma football were necessarily angels in this deal.</p>
<p>Give Wilkinson credit for integrating in the &#8217;50s.  Note also that the Big 6 conference had been integrated for awhile already.  Also note that he stopped integrating, and why.</p>
<p>Also, in your article, did you note the comments about the Arkansas 1965 football staff, and how cruel it could be?  You do know who were assistants on that staff, don&#8217;t you?</p>
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		<title>By: NateHeupel</title>
		<link>http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2008/06/09/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-14018</link>
		<dc:creator>NateHeupel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:27:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/taylortroom/the-history-of-college-football-recruiting-cheating-part-4#comment-14018</guid>
		<description>Good reading:  &lt;a href=&quot;http://richardpennington.com/index.php?option=com_content&amp;task=view&amp;id=28&amp;Itemid=1&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;LINK&lt;/a&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good reading:  <a href="http://richardpennington.com/index.php?option=com_content&amp;task=view&amp;id=28&amp;Itemid=1" rel="nofollow">LINK</a></p>
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